Advanced Techniques
Sources: JPN Garou Wiki and Yoshimizu, JPN Garou Wiki Translation, and Garou Discord Group
Reverse Guard
A reverse guard situation is when you have to block or JD in the opposite (reverse) direction, even if it looks like an attack from the front.
Cross-ups are any attack that requires a reverse guard, but usually refer to jumping attacks that hit on the other side.
Back hit animation:
When someone gets hit by a cross-up, their sprite doesn't switch to the correct side.
So you're hitting their back but their hit sprite reels back like you're hitting their front.
Cross-up Jump-In
These jump-in attacks (and less often hop-in attacks) are done at the right spacing and time to hit on the opposite side (usually side-switching after hitting).
After doing something like a cross-up jump attack and side-switching,
the moment the hitstun or blockstun ends, the reverse guard goes back to normal guard.
To guard a cross-up, you need to enter the direction input towards the opponent.
Example: Grant's cross-up j.B > 2A, 2A becomes a reverse guard situation.
※ The same situation will occur if you do an air turn-around attack of Gato or Hotaru
that needs to be blocked through the "front" side.
Ambiguous Cross-ups
You'll sometimes see jump attacks that hit from the front, then the attacker lands on the other side.
Likewise, you'll sometimes see cross-ups hit from the back, then the attacker lands in the front.
Especially with attacks you walk forward into, end up cross-up JDing, but they land in the front.
This is because although you hit the other side, the your collision box hasn't gone far enough.
Cross-up Jump Attack JD:
When you JD a cross-up attack, throwing the opponent is a great option.
Especially if your opponent side-switches, your throw should still beat out most attacks:
- the cross-up pushes you toward the opponent and into throw range
- frame advantage from being [[Garou:_Mark_of_the_Wolves/Movement#Jump_Normal_Advantage hit at the top of your hurtbox]
- frame advantage from the JD
- your opponent's button timing may be thrown off by the JD, getting their inputs eaten by the extra JD hitlag, possibly causing a misinput or a gap in their pressure.
Corner Cross-up Bug
This is a corner jump attack that becomes a reverse guard cross-up (Also known as "Reverse Guard Throw Glitch").
A limited number of characters' throw in the corner
puts the opponent on the ground in reverse.
Rather than oriented toward you, they are oriented toward the corner.
On wake-up, on this short time period they stay reversed before orienting themselves toward you again.
After that throw, you can do a specific jump attack.
Even though it looks like an attack from the front, rather it becomes a reverse guard situation.
Your guard is reversed and you have to block the opposite direction like you would for a cross-up.
Otherwise if you try to block normally, it's like you're holding forward into the jump attack.
After that, you will land in front of the opponent and the guard direction will return to normal
(while still pushing the opponent back into the corner).
When the opponent is still in hitstun/blockstun, you can continue with ground attacks as a follow-up after landing.
There is a strong setplay that arises from whether you go for this.
Please see the table below for characters that can do this throw
and their jump attacks that can cross-up afterwards.
| Character | Corresponding Throw | Jump Attack |
| Rock Howard | C throw, Vacuum Throw | A, C, D |
| Terry Bogard | C Throw | B, C, D |
| Kim Dong Hwan | C Throw | A, B, D, j.2K, j.236(x2)P |
| Kim Jae Hoon | C Throw | A, B, j.2K |
| Hotaru Futaba ※ 1 | C Throw | A, B, D, j.2B, j.214K |
| Gato | C Throw | B, D |
| B. Jenet ※ 2 | C Throw | B, C, D, j.2K |
| Kevin Rian | C Throw | A, C |
| Tizoc/Griffon ※ 3 | C Throw (Grif-Fall follow-up works too) | C |
| Grant ※ 4 | C Throw | B, D, j.2K |
The trick to set up this setplay
is to dash for from a half-character to one-character distance after the throw,
then jump to the corner of the screen. (※ 5)
The corresponding jump attack should be launched with a high point of impact
(hitting at the top of the opponent's hurtbox).
If you set the opponent to ALL GUARD
in the PRACTICE MODE (on AES or home versions)
and set up the above set play,
it will only get a hit for the jump attack when you are in reverse guard,
so it is perfect for practice.
Naturally, other jump attacks and special moves
can also be used for guard advantage if you change the point of impact,
making them difficult to handle as the opponent mixes the use of their options.
The mindgame when someone jumps at you is whether you attack on the way down or not.
But with this setup you add a left/right mix to it.
Most of the outcomes are favorable to you,
but they can still pick the right direction and GC.
You still have to weight risk/reward and not autopilot.
※ 1... Cannot be used against Hokutomaru, Gato, Grant, and Kain.
※ 2... When aiming for a reverse guard with B on Jenet and Grant, wait a little after the throw and then perform a super jump.
※ 3... Cannot be used against Hokutomaru, and can only be used against Kain after Grif-Fall.
※ 4... Kevin, Freeman, Terry, Grant, and Kain cannot be reverse guarded with D.
※ 5... Jenet can walk, Griffon can only walk. Hotaru jumps the moment the throwstun (the throw itself) ends.
- To summarize
- Setup
-
- throw in the corner > jump above cornered opponent > if they hold back, their character will be turned around therefore they will block in the wrong direction.
- Escape
-
- JD or block in the opposite direction.
Reverse Guard Glitch
Discovered by Naoyan, and shown by Kota in this link.
There is a reverse guard after a cross-up.
For 1F, the guard is reversed on the first frame after blockstun after a cross-up.
It's like the character is taking 1F of animation to re-orient and correctly face the opponent.
After a blocked cross-up, it would be difficult to block such a follow-up.
Cross-Under
Related to the cross-up, this refers to walking or dashing under the opponent while they are airborne. (Also referred to as a cross-down.)
You are either punishing their landing recovery, and/or doing a left/right mix-up.
Most of the time, you are anticipating a front jump-in or cross-up:
- you slightly walk forward to avoid the attack, and then do your own attack
- or you dash forward to avoid the attack, adjust by walking towards the opponent as needed, and then do your own attack
There are other situations where you can cross-under dash:
- after an air-to-air attack
- after a ground-to-air attack on a higher airborne opponent
- Depends on many factors
- character dash/run speed. Some characters have an easier time crossing under (Kain, Kevin, Grant, Jae, Freeman to name a few)
- Height ! The higher they are, the easier it is to dash or run under.
- Character height ! Hokutomaru can run under hops for instance
- The move you use to air to air. Light normals have less active and recovery frames, allowing you to start your dash sooner
- Jump arc, you must jump forward in most cases, so you can land as close to your opponent as possible
Example of hitting the lower part of the opponent, and then start dashing while the opponent is still in recovery (Notice the opponent's air reset sprite)
Another example, with a ground reset
Another example, with a dash run type character (jumping around the same time, opponent needs more time to land as he is slightly launched into the air before going through recovery animation)
JD-Disabling Moves at 0-Pixel Health Bar
Health for all character is at 121 life points. But you'll see only 120 of those points shown on the health bar; the last 1 point is hidden. So when you take the opponent's health bar down to 0 pixel health, they actually have that 1 hidden life point left.
When your health bar is at 0 pixels, certain special/super moves
will become impossible to JD, both on the ground and in the air (i.e., defend against chip KO's).
In this game, if a player guards against a move, a singular hit, that causes a large amount of chip damage, no matter how much chip damage, as long as the player has at least 1 life point on the health bar remaining, they can withstand that move and have health bar reduced to 0 pixels (i.e., actually having the 1 hidden life point left).
There are many scenarios where you try to chip out the opponent
but you might unexpectedly just put them at 0 pixels and then be open to be attacked.
At 0 pixels, the moves below become impossible to just defend:
(unless otherwise noted, the list includes both weak or strong versions of moves)
- [Rock]
- Reppu-ken (236A), Double Reppu-ken (236C), Crack Counter (236K),
- Rising Tackle ([2]8P), Raging Storm (236(x2)P)
- [Terry]
- Power Wave (236P), Burn Knuckle (214P), Power Dunk (623K), Power Geyser (236(x2)P)
- [Dong]
- Raimei Zan (214K), Kuusa-jin (623P), Hishou-kyaku (j.2K),
- Raimei Dan (236(x2)D version last level/stage only)
- [Jae]
- Hien-zan ([2]8K), Hangetsu-zan (214K),
- Hishou-kyaku (j.2K) (The overhead and low follow-ups can be JDed)
- [Hotaru]
- Hakki-shou (236P), Kobi-Kyaku (214K), Weak Tenshin-shuu (623B),
- Weak Sou-shou Shin (214A)
- [Gato]
- Shin-ga (236P) (including follow-up),
- Rai-ga (623K), Fuu-ga (214K), Kou-ga (214K~A)
- [Jenny]
- Crazy Ivan (214P), Gulf Tomahawk (214K), Baffles (236P), D. Hind (236K)
- [Butt/Marco]
- Ko-ou-ken (236P), Hien Shippu-Kyaku (236K),
- Dragon Flash Fist (charge [C]), Tiger Flash Leg (charge [D]),
- Ha-ou Shoukou Ken (236(x2)P),
- Dragon Tiger Ranbu Lv4 (Only the projectile part. The hit/strike part can be JDed)
- [Hokutomaru]
- Karakusa-Kiri (214P), Rakka-ki (real) (214D),
- Shuriken (236P), Kuu-ha-dan (236K), Super Deadly Shuriken (236(x2)A),
- Super Explosion Kunai (236(x2)C)
- [Freeman]
- Nightmare (236P), Crow (214K), Phobia (623P), Full Blast (236(x2)P)
- [Tizoc/Griffon]
- Olympus Over (214K), Poseidon Wave (421P)
- [Kevin]
- Hell Roaster/Rotor (214P), Hell Trap (236K)
- [Grant]
- Black Flame Dragon (214P), Evil Bird Blade (623P),
- Weak Messhou Hisetsu (j.2B), Weak Gou Dangai (236B)
- [Kain]
- All moves except for TOP
Anti Guard Cancel (Guard Cancel Crushing)
On the Tactics Regarding Guard Cancels:
Guard cancel (GC) tends to be thought as this overpowered universal counter mechanic, but there is also counter play against GC.
Roughly categorized:
1. Against GC moves with slow start-up, do target combos and light normal chain cancels
2. Use invincible moves as the GC counter/reversal/response
One of the advantages of GC counter/reversal/response, is to make the opponent hesitate
to GC, and one example of that is taking a counter-hit off of them
-- to counter-hit a GC with a special move that acts as a GC counter/reversal/response.
Conversely, against a GC counter/reversal/response, you can counter the counter with your own GC counter/reversal/response, and that is where reading the next layers of moves of your opponent comes in.
Also, characters with only slow start-up GC moves will be crushed by target combos, multi-hit moves, and chain canceling light normals. This can make for a tough fight that you need to be careful with.
See below for a list of techniques
used for guard cancels and GC counter/reversal/responses.
GCing against Jump Attacks:
In the situation of a GC done against a jump attack, a character that can cancel their landing recovery with an invincible move, against a GC move with a startup of 4F or more, can crush (beat out) that GC.
The same is true for small jumps, but in either case, the timing of the position where the attack hits (vertically) and the timing of the landing cancel is important.
See the "Jumps" section for the landing recovery of jump attacks.
Main Special moves used to Guard Cancel:
| Character | Move | Startup | Notes |
| Rock Howard | Weak Hard Edge (214A) | 11F | it won't hit against a weak attack that is +6F or more |
| Vacuum throw (214C) | 11F | command throw | |
| Terry Bogard | Power Dunk (623K) | 3F | |
| Kim Dong Hwan | Kuusa-jin (623K) | 4F | If doing as a GC counter/reversal/response, it does a counter hit |
| Kim Jae Hoon | Hien-zan ([2]8K) | 4F | |
| Hotaru Futaba | Command throw (41236D) | 9F | command throw |
| Hakki-shou (236P) | 10F | ||
| Kobi-Kyaku (214K) | 13F | If doing as a GC counter/reversal/response, it does a counter hit. it won't hit against a weak attack that is +4F or more | |
| Gato | Rai-ga (623K) | 3F | |
| Weak Fuu-ga (214B) | 6F | ||
| Strong Fuu-ga (214D) | 7F | ||
| B. Jenet | TOP ("Rolling Thunder") (CD) | 9F | |
| Weak D. Hind (236B) | 9F | ||
| Weak Crazy Ivan (214A) | 11F | it won't hit against a weak attack that is +6F or more | |
| Ennui Mademoiselle (after JD, A~B~C) | 6F | ||
| Khushnood Butt/Marco | Ko-ou-hou (623P) | 4F | If doing as a GC counter/reversal/response, it does a counter hit |
| Ko-ou-ken (236P) | 9F | ||
| Hokutomaru | Weak Kuu-ha-dan (236B) | 11F | it won't hit against a weak attack that is +6F or more |
| Freeman | Weak VOD (214A) | 9F | |
| Tizoc/Griffon | Justice Hurricane (360 P) | 3F | command throw |
| Kevin Rian | Weak Hell Arrest (41236A) | 8F | command throw |
| Strong Hell Arrest (41236C) | 9F | command throw | |
| Weak Hell Trap (236B) | 10F | If doing as a GC counter/reversal/response, it does a counter hit | |
| Grant | Strong Evil Bird Blade (623C) | 5F | |
| Weak Gou Dangai (236B) | 11F | it won't hit against a weak attack that is +6F or more | |
| Kain R. Heinlein | Schwarz Lanze ([2]8K) | 6F |
Strings Used for Crushing/Beating Out Guard Cancel:
Strings refers to chain cancels, target combos, light special cancel, etc.
If the startup of the move used as a guard cancel is the same or is more than the numerical value in the "Minimum Crushing GC Startup" column in the following table, that guard cancel will be crushed/beat out by the corresponding string.
About the blank space, because the string includes an invincible move, it is from the start expected to crush/beat out the GC move. It's left blank because it's unnecessary to compare a numerical value.
| Character | String | Minimum Crushing GC Startup | Cancel | Situation After Move | Notes |
| Rock Howard | cl.5A chain cancel | 7F | ◯ | +6F | |
| Double Reppu-ken (236C) | 1F | - | +0 | ||
| j.C~B | 6F | - | - | ||
| Terry Bogard | 2B > Strong Dunk (2B > 623D) | - | -2F | Can do after-cancel with 263B+C > D | |
| cl.A chain cancel | 7F | ◯ | +7F | ||
| cl.5C > C | 6F | × | +4F | Can be linked to P-power Geyser (236(x2)C) | |
| Kim Dong Hwan | 2B > Kuusa-jin (2B > 623K) | - | -6F | Can do after-cancel with 263B+C > A(C) | |
| cl.A chain cancel | 7F | ◯ | +6F | ||
| j.A~C | 10F | × | - | ||
| Kim Jae Hoon | 2B > Strong Hien-zan (2B > [2]8D) | - | +0 | ||
| 2B chain cancel | 8F | ◯ | +6F | ||
| j.A~C | 11F | - | - | ||
| Hotaru Futaba | cl.5A chain cancel | 7F | ◯ | +5F | |
| j.A~B | 5F | × | - | ||
| Gato | cl.5D | 5F | × | +5F | |
| cl.5A chain cancel | 7F | ◯ | +6F | ||
| j.B~A | 6F | - | - | ||
| B. Jenet | A > A > A | 6F | × | +2F | |
| j.C | 4F | ◯ | - | ||
| Khushnood Butt/Marco | cl.C(D) > Weak Ko-ou-hou ((cl.5C OR cl.5D) > 623A) | 8F | - | +2F | |
| cl.5A chain cancel | 8F | × | +6F | ||
| Hokutomaru | A > B | 10F | ◯ | +1F | |
| j.A~B | 4F | × | - | ||
| j.C~B | 6F | × | - | ||
| Freeman | cl.5A > A | 8F | × | -1F | |
| cl.5B chain cancel | 7F | ◯ | +6F | ||
| cl.5D | 6F | × | -2F | ||
| Strong VOD (2-stage) ((214C)(x2)) | 11F | - | -12F | If linking to Strong VOD (3-stage), it's -1F | |
| Tizoc/Griffon | Light normal > 6A+C | 3F | - | - | However, only for moves that do not have low hitbox |
| Grant | Weak Evil Bird Blade (623A) | 5F | - | -24F | If you do j.2K follow-up, there is no such gap |
| Kain R. Heinlein | A > lanze | - | +11F | ||
| 2B > lanze | - | +11F | See "Pseudo Chain Cancel" section | ||
| 2AB > 5C | 10F | ◯ | -16F | +10F through doing feint cancel | |
| 2A chain cancel | 7F | × | +4F |
Ennui Counter/Reversal/Response
One way to respond to Jenet's GC-only P-power super "Ennui Mademoiselle" is to enter only the motion and then just the button after the Ennui's freeze/blackout.
For example, Rock can do a f.5A > Crack Counter response with A > 236 > freeze/blackout > B
It's possible to use the above input for supers from a weak attack, but it requires you to quickly do the motion before the freeze/blackout.
| Character | Moves you can respond with | Notes |
| Rock Howard | Crack Counter (236K) | |
| Rising Tackle ([2]8P) | ||
| Terry Bogard | Strong Power Dunk (623D) | Don't break |
| S-Power Power Geyser (236(x2)A) | After a counter-hit you can do a Jenet-only combo | |
| Kim Dong Hwan | Kuusa-jin (623K) | |
| Raimei-Dan (236(x2)K) | trade | |
| Kim Jae Hoon | P-power Houyoku Tenshou-kyaku (236(x2)C) | Hien-zan doesn't work |
| Hotaru Futaba | Tenshin-shuu (623K) | only a part of the super hits |
| Ten-shou Range (236(x2)K) | whiffed jump out of maximum combo into less hits | |
| Gato | Ryuu-ga (236(x2)K) | only a part of the super hits |
| B. Jenet | Weak Gulf Tomahawk | whiff out of combo |
| Khushnood Butt/Marco | Kyokugen Kohou (236(x2)K) | only a part of the super hits |
| Hokutomaru | 2AB~BC | only a part of the super hits when Hoku is in mid-air |
| Freeman | Creeping Death (236(x2)K) | |
| Full Blast (236(x2)P) | after trading you can chase after to follow-up | |
| Tizoc/Griffon | Strong Poseidon Wave (421C) | only a part of the super hits |
| Active Tupon (623P) | leaves a gap dependent on the distance | |
| Kevin Rian | Avoid Mine (214D) | |
| Grant | None | |
| Kain R. Heinlein | Lanze | possible through a pseudo chain cancel |
Forced Stop Moves (0F Moves) Workings and Explanation
Overview:
For most supers, the first frame of execution is not the start of its actual startup.
You go into the super's beginning animation -- super "freeze" or "flash" or "blackout".
When blackout ends you then go into "forced time stop".
At the end of forced time stop, that's when you go into the super's startup.
Blackout and Forced Time Stop
On the frame you complete the super command, you go into blackout.
The standard S-power blackout is 31F long, while for P-power it is 58F long.
After your blackout, the opponent is still unable to move during the subsequent forced time stop. (Time stops only for the opponent and only the person who performed the technique moves.)
Supers have various forced time stop lengths.
- Some characters a have a window to input follow-up button presses during their blackout and/or forced time stop
- Holding the button through blackout, forced time stop, and longer (Jae's super C and Freeman's super A/C)
- Pressing buttons during blackout and/or forced time stop (Butt/Marco's hidden super)
- This is useful, but not required, for Rock's hidden super.
- Oppositely, during your opponent's blackout and forced time stop, there are some properties that dictate your buffering
- On the 1F of your opponent's blackout, your command input buffer is frozen.
- Your current buffer is frozen and preserved through blackout and forced time stop, even if you let go of your current direction.
The buffer resumes after you exit forced time stop. - Motions and other commands cannot be done and are not recognized.
- Button and direction inputs alone are recognized.
- Press any button and the attack comes out after blackout and after forced time stop.
This works with simultaneous button presses, except for feints and TOP attacks. - Once an attack is recognized, no other attack is recognized.
- For example, when the input 2AB is accepted, no other button presses afterwards matter, The 2AB comes out after forced time stop.
- Press any button and the attack comes out after blackout and after forced time stop.
- Your current buffer is frozen and preserved through blackout and forced time stop, even if you let go of your current direction.
Supers and Startup
Newer games have frame data with the last startup frame as also the first active frame. But the Garou frame data uses an old frame data style where the first active frame is after the last startup frame.
If we consider the first frame as the 0F rather than the 1F, normals can adhere to the new style. But we don't this.
However, this is different in the case of supers.
For supers, the last two frames of forced time stop are included with the startup. They are labeled as the "0F" and the "1F" of startup.
And you could see how this makes sense from the old frame data style.
For example, Freeman's super Full Blast
looks like it has a 12F startup time after blackout.
And it looks like it has 10F startup if you don't include forced time stop.
But because there are only 2 frames of forced time stop, those 2 frames will be the 0〜1F of startup.
The startup time is then 11F, active on the 12F.
(Note: Unlike with other attacks, you can't move during the first 1F of a super because it is during forced time stop. This means that the gap you have to move before a super hits is 1F less than the startup indicates.)
For 1F supers, after exiting the last two frames 0〜1F of forced time stop,
on the 2F frame there is the first active frame.
And after that frame you go into hitstop/blockstop.
In other words, the super is 1F startup, active on the 2F.
As for 0F supers, they are a particular move, just abbreviated as a "0F move". With the last two frames 0〜1F of forced time stop, the last frame at 1F possesses a hitbox -- an active frame.
After exiting the 0〜1F of forced time stop, on the next frame 2F they hit like a 1F active move (like a throw).
In other words, the super is 0F startup, active on the 1F.
For such moves, even if the guard input is done after blackout, you won't be able to block and defend against it.
That's because the super is determined to hit, block, or whiff based on what you do before blackout.
List of Forced Time Stop and Startup Frames for Supers:
| Character | Super | Forced Time Stop | Startup |
Notes |
| Rock Howard | Raging Storm A | 2F | 12F | |
| Raging Storm C | 2F | 17F | ||
| Shining Knuckle B | 6F | 1F | ||
| Shining Knuckle D | 7F | 0F | ||
| Deadly Rave Neo (Hidden Super) | 5F | 0F |
Follow-up inputs are accepted starting at the 10F of BO until the 3rd frame of FTS. Inputs are then accepted again during the hitstop of the each hit. | |
| Terry Bogard | Power Geyser A | 9F | 7F | |
| Power Geyser C | 9F | 3F | ||
| Buster Wolf B | 2F | 7F | ||
| Buster Wolf D | 5F | 4F | ||
| Kim Dong Hwan | Super Dong Hwan Kick A | 8F | 0F | |
| Super Dong Hwan Kick C | 8F | 0F | ||
| Raimei Dan B | 2F | 19F | ||
| Raimei Dan D | 2F | 17F | All levels have the same FTS | |
| Ore-sama Hou'ou Kyaku (Hidden Super) | 3F | 0F | ||
| Kim Jae Hoon | Houyoku Tenshou Kyaku A | 2F | 11F | |
| Houyoku Tenshou Kyaku C | 2F | 11F | Super with follow-up has the same FTS | |
| Houou Kyaku B | 5F | 0F | ||
| Houou Kyaku D | 5F | 0F | ||
| Hotaru Futaba | Sou Shou Ten Renge A | 2F | 6F | |
| Sou Shou Ten Renge C | 2F | 6F | ||
| Ten Shou Ran Ki B | 8F | 0F | ||
| Ten Shou Ran Ki D | 7F | 0F | ||
| Gato | Rei-ga A | 5F | 0F | |
| Rei-ga C | 5F | 0F | ||
| Ryuu-ga B | 2F | 3F | ||
| Ryuu-ga D | 2F | 3F | ||
| Tenryuu Retsu-ga (Hidden Super) (last move) | 2F | 14F | ||
| B. Jenet | Many Many Torpedoes A | 2F | 4F | |
| Many Many Torpedoes C | 2F | 4F | ||
| Aurora B | 6F | 0F | ||
| Aurora D | 6F | 0F | ||
| Ennui Mademoiselle (Hidden GC Super) | 2F | 6F | ||
| Butt/Marco | Haou Shoukou Ken A | 2F | 17F | |
| Haou Shoukou Ken C | 2F | 7F | ||
| Kyokugen Kohou B | 5F | 0F | ||
| Kyokugen Kohou D | 5F | 0F | ||
| Ryuuko Ranbu (Hidden Super) Lv 1, 2, 3 | 6F | 0F | Window to press C: 3～58F of BO, and 1～2F of FTS. | |
| Ryuuko Ranbu Lv 4 | 7F | 4F | ||
| Hokutomaru | Chou Hissatsu Shuriken A | 2F | 9F | |
| Chou Bakuen Kunai C | 2F | 9F | ||
| Ougi • Chou Hissatsu Tatsumaki B | 4F | 1F | ||
| Kyuukyoku Ougi • Chou Bakuen Tatsumaki D | 5F | 0F | ||
| Freeman | Full Blast A | 2F | 11F | |
| Full Blast C | 2F | 11F | ||
| Creeping Death B | Variable FTS and startup (for a total of 14F) after counter is initiated.
(Dependent on the attack being countered.) Examples: 9F FTS, 6F startup; 12F FTS, 3F startup; 13F FTS, 2F startup. | |||
| Creeping Death D | Variable FTS and startup (for a total of 13F) after counter is initiated.
(Dependent on the attack being countered.) Examples: 9F FTS, 5F startup; 13F FTS, 1F startup. | |||
| Tizoc/Griffon | Big Fall Griffon A | 5F | 1F | |
| Big Fall Griffon C | 5F | 1F | ||
| Daedalus Attack B | 2F | 14F | ||
| Daedalus Attack D | 2F | 13F | ||
| Kevin Rian | Lucky Strike A | 2F | 3F | |
| Lucky Strike C | 2F | 3F | ||
| Gattling Freezer B | 2F | 11F | ||
| Gattling Freezer D | 11F | 0F | ||
| Grant | Majin Haten Dan A | 2F | 11F | |
| Majin Haten Dan C | 2F | 9F | ||
| Majin Engetsu Rin B | 9F | 0F | ||
| Majin Engetsu Rin D | 9F | 0F | ||
| Kain R. Heinlein | Himmlisch Atem A | 9F | 1F | |
| Himmlisch Atem C | 10F | 2F | ||
| Himmlisch Seele B | 10F | 13F | ||
| Himmlisch Seele D | 10F | 9F |
0F Move Guard-Impossible Phenomenon
If a 0F move is performed under certain conditions, it will become unguardable even though a guard was input before the freeze/blackout.
This 0F Move Guard-Impossible phenomenon, which is unique to this game and is a very important element, occurs under the following conditions:
| Situation When Doing the 0F Move | Avoidance Method |
| +4F or more advantageous normal hit | unavoidable, treated as a combo |
| +2,3F advantageous normal hit | backdash |
| +1F advantageous normal hit | backdash, ave maria (after-cancel) |
| -1F normal, special move on block | backdash, ave maria (after-cancel) |
| -2F normal on block or hit | backdash |
| -2F or more disadvantage special move on block | unavoidable |
| -3F or more disadvantage normal on block or hit | unavoidable |
| Landing after receiving a mid-air hit and not getting knockdowned (air-hit landing recovery) | backdash, ave maria (after-cancel) |
(1) From a 2〜3 frame advantage situation,
if doing a 0F move, it can be avoided (backdash only),
but it cannot be blocked.
(2) From a 1 frame advantage situation,
if doing a 0F move, it can be avoided (ave maria, backdash),
but it cannot be blocked.
(3) If receiving a hit from an non-knockdowning attack in mid-air,
then since landing it takes 3 frames (Hokutomaru takes 4 frames)
before you can move again (air-hit landing recovery).
See this video showing how there is no hurtbox after an air hit and you cannot be hit during those landing frames.
However, during these frames' latter half 2 frames, if a 0F move is done, then you are able to avoid it, but not block against it. (On the 1st frame of landing, the 0F move whiffs.)
(1) has only one avoidance method, a backdash, and the prior input window is very short.
Also, the 0F reversal done after blocking a -2F normal move can be avoided with a backdash, but the 0F reversal done after blocking a -2F special move cannot be avoided.
(2) and (3) have no choice but to avoid with the techniques
called prior-input backdash or ave maria (after-cancel).
However, some 0F moves (rush/charge-type, long duration) cannot be avoided by backdashing.
Some 0F moves (such as long-lasting rushes) cannot be avoided by backstep, some require a gauge, and some techniques may not be able to win depending on their compatibility.
Even if you use an ave maria (after-cancel),
you may need to use a super move,
and even those super moves might not be able to win depending
on the compatibility with what's done against you.
For more details about this part of the section,
please refer to the section about and the techniques used for Ave Maria.
List of 0F Moves (unless otherwise indicated, both S-power and P-power versions are 0F moves)
| Character | Move Name |
| Rock Howard | P-power Shining Knuckle (236(x2)D), Deadly Rave |
| Terry Bogard | None |
| Kim Dong Hwan | Super Don Juan Legs (j.236(x2)P), Ore-sama Hou-ou Ashi (236(x3)C) |
| Kim Jae Hoon | Hou-ou-kyaku (236(x2)K) |
| Hotaru Futaba | Ten-shou Ran-ge (236(x2)K) |
| Gato | Rei-ga (236(x2)P) |
| B. Jenet | Aurora (236(x2)K) |
| Khushnood Butt/Marco | Kyokugen Kohou (236(x2)K), Ryuuko Ranbu (236(x3)C) Lv1~3 |
| Hokutomaru | Kyūkyoku ōgi ・ chō bakuen tatsumaki (236(x2)D) |
| Freeman | None |
| Tizoc/Griffon | None |
| Kevin Rian | P-power Gatling Freezer (236(x2)D) |
| Grant | Majin Engetsurin (236(x2)K) |
| Kain R. Heinlein | None |
Regarding 1F Startup Moves
There are two 1F startup moves: Rock's S-power Shining Knuckle (236(x2)B) and Hokutomaru's Ougi・Chou Hissatsu Tatsumaki (236(x2)B).
But these moves are also a bit special in that they can likely miss, so we should present what they are about.
◯ After doing a +2F, +3F normal,
a 1F startup move does not connect into a confirm.
∵ It's possible to JD the super when Rock does 2A (+3F) OR cl.5B (+2F) > S-power Shining Knuckle
◯ Against a -2F normal, a reversal 1F startup move does not counter-attack confirm.
∵ Freeman can JD a reversal S-power Shining Knuckle done after Freeman cl.5D (-2F).
◯ Against -3F normal OR -2F super, a reversal 1F startup move can counter-attack confirm.
∵ Against Jenet's 2AB on block (-3F), or Terry's Power Dunk (BR) (-2F), super S-power Shining Knuckle can counter-attack confirm.
○ Landing 1F combos:
Do a non-knockdowning hit in mid-air, and 1F before the opponent lands, do one of the two 1F startup moves to hit when they land.
Unlike the 0F on landing "meaty" described above, the 1F meaty needs to be done while the opponent is in the air 1F before landing, so there is no way to avoid it (and to connect the hits)
In the case of Hokutomaru,
(in the corner) Kuu-ha-dan break (236K (BR)) > 3D, Air Shuriken. It is good to try to connect the 1F super after the shuriken, but the difficulty is high.
This video "【餓狼MOW】着地前1F技コンボ解説【ロック・北斗丸】" shows it in application: {{#evt: service=nico |id=https://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm15926944 |alignment= |dimensions=480x320 |urlargs= }}
Jae and Dong AB against Tizoc/Griffon
Jae/Dong's AB is airborne on the first frame. This is useful for avoiding throws.
Especially for Tizoc/Griffon Super 720 A/C.
You can press AB during blackout, it avoids the super throw.
During the super throw's 1F startup, the AB comes out airborne.
Simultaneous Button Press for Normals
When a simultaneous button press occurs, an attack will come out following this priority:
Buttons and Their Corresponding Simultaneous Multiple Inputs:
| A | A+C or A+D |
| B | B+C or B+D |
| C | A+C+D or B+C+D or A+B+C+D (or C+D outside of TOP) |
| D | Cannot be done if you use simultaneous button press |
| evasion attacks | A+B or A+B+C or A+B+D |
| TOP | C+D while in TOP mode |
Note: Simultaneous inputs are just frame: have to be pressed on the exact same frame.
Simultaneous button inputs are useful for doing throws, throw techs, throw tech option-select and other option-selects.
Particularly, it's useful for the option-selects centered around executing special/super moves.
Even if the special/super move command is entered correctly, if buttons are pressed simultaneously, the special/super move will never be executed.
Most likely, the game only recognizes commands with a single button.
(The only exception is Gato's hidden super, Tenryu Retsu Kiba (623AB)(x3).)
By using this method, you can avoid misinputs by preventing special/super moves from executing.
You can prevent normals and upper-body evasion attacks from accidentally kara canceling after doing a command motion too quickly during their startup.
And you can intentionally not do special/super moves. Do normals even after you buffered special/super moves.
For example, Kain can also use this to rush in with a light without worrying about charge time.
By not doing the buffered special/super, even if a normal comes out, the buffer can still be in effect.
This property allows you to do the "Motion Storing Technique" detailed below.
Motion Storing Technique
This application of simultaneous button inputs is known as the "Motion Storing Technique"
You "override" the special with a simultaneous input to do a button attack instead.
Therefore if you do 
+ 
+ 
, a normal stand will come out, not a fireball or whatever special was + or + .
This allows you to "store" motions to make combos easier.
For example, you can avoid the mistakes prone to using chain canceling -- the mis-inputting of a QCF special move afterwards -- like the command executing after the light's cancel window and coming out as a reversal.
Canceling light attacks into supers : xx requires very fast execution, you can instead do (stand A) xx (Super comes out, thanks to the first previously stored)
Pseudo Chain Cancels
Light/Weak attacks normally not special cancelable can cancel into specials and supers using the chain cancel property.
The weak attack you want to cancel must be chain cancelable (repeatable).
The next chained attack kara cancels into the special or super.
This method is also just called chain canceling (or renda canceling) for short.
Example:
Let's use Butt/Marco's 2B > Strong Ko-ou-Ken as an example.
Usually entering the 236C during hitstop/blockstop won’t allow a special cancel and it won’t come out.
But by entering 2B > 236+C > 2B
-- by inputting the second 2B at the same time you would normally chain cancel the first 2B's recovery --
236C ends up chain canceling the first 2B.
The principle of how the cancelation is possible is that by inputting 236+C after 2B,
the command for the strong Ko-ou-Ken is completed, but the special cancelation does not take place.
The special cancelation is not applied, so naturally the strong Ko-ou-Ken does not come out.
However, after that, by inputting 2B at the timing to chain cancel from the first 2B, the second 2B comes out....
However, because the special move command's reception still remains as registered,
at that moment it's like the cancelation was applied to the second 2B.
The timing of the strong Ko-ou-Ken comes out as if the 2B was canceled,
This is due to the fact that all normal moves in this game can be kara canceled, regardless of whether they can be canceled on hit/block or not.
Also, if the Special Move you wish to perform
uses the same button as the Weak Attack you perform a pseudo chain cancel with,
the input is slightly relaxed (easier).
For example, Butt/Marco's 2B Weak Hien Shippu-Kyaku can be done by pressing 2B > 2362B
Butt/Marco's Standing A > Weak Ko-ou-Ken can be done with A > 2364A
Kain's 2B > Weak Lanze can be done with 2B > 82B.
Ave Maria
Ave Maria is a term that covers all the techniques to avoid 0F supers.
They are the techniques and avoidance methods dealing with blackout and forced stop time. (Refer to the table in that section.)
- The most notable Ave Maria technique (and synonymous with it) is the "After-Cancel".
- By doing simultaneous button pressing and putting out a normal move while doing special or super move command, it's possible to use those specials or supers in the following situations
- A 0F move is done on you when you the defender is at a 1F disadvantage;
- A 0F move is done on you when you the defender returns to the ground after taking an attack in mid-air; and so on.
All kinds of "0F moves that can be avoided but cannot be guarded"
can be counter-attacked against.
In addition to the defensive uses listed above,
After-Cancel can also be used mainly to reduce the risk
when doing okizeme (attacking on someones recovery/wake-up).
This video,
"Garou MOTW 0F Showcase - Application, Escapes, Counters and Option Selects"
shows some of this section in action:
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Air Hit Landing Unblockable Example
Situation: Hotaru's Ten-Shou Range (236(x2)K) after-cancel is done during Grant's air hit landing unblockable with Engetsu Rin (236(x2)K) on the 2nd frame of Hotaru's landing.
1. As Hotaru, input 23623＋A＋D within a range of 5F -- from 3 frames before landing until the 1st frame of blackout.
(Consistent with the buffer/interval of 7F for the reversal reception window of a normal, after an air hit landing: consisting of 3F before landing, 3F of air hit landing recovery, and 1F after that)
2. When Grant does his super and goes into blackout, repeatedly press
B or D (S-power or P-power, whichever super you want to get out).
3. After Grant's blackout, Ten-Shou Range is put out for a counter-attack.
The reason why the above is possible is that when the 0F move
is performed during the animation of an opponent's move (normal or special), the opponent becomes invincible during forced stop time.
When the hitbox of the 0F collides/overlaps with the opponent's hurtbox, that invincibility will end. That 0F move effectively changes into acting like how a 1F-active move hits (hitting on that next 1 frame).
※During the 0F move animation after exiting blackout,
it counts as a state of both startup and recovery.
Due to this phenomenon, the "1F move" can be "kara canceled" out of, which means that an after-cancel is formed at that time too.
Air Hit Landing Unblockable Example 2
Button presses before and after blackout need to be different:
In additon to the after-cancel method of simultaneously button pressing a normal move (also upper and lower evasive attacks) with a special/super move command before blackout, another after-cancel method is to do this special/super command with a single button, and then pressing a button different from the one pressed before the blackout to activate the special move.
This works as long as you are within such a recovery that the special/super doesn't come out immediately.
It is important to note that the button pressed before
blackout and the button pressed after blackout must be different.
If the button pressed before and after blackout is the same,
your special/super move won't come out and your opponent's 0-frame move will hit you instead.
Also, a simultaneous button pressing with a button is considered different from that button pressed alone.
e.g., B+D can be used before blackout and B can be used after blackout.
(Source: チラシの裏にでも書いてろ）
Example 2:
To explain with the previous air hit landing unblockable example,
if you enter 23623AorBorCorD in the first part, and in the second part,
repeatedly press any button other than the one you pressed in the first part,
then after blackout, if it is AorC, it will activate Sou-shou Ten Renge (236(x2)P),
and if it is BorD, it will activate Ten-Shou Range (236(x2)K).
※ (Just like the previous example, the first part's input has the window/buffer of the reversal timing for normals,
a reversal reception of 7F total, and this has to be at or before blackout.)
Invincible Special Example
Invincible DPing a 0F Punish of Your -1 Hit
This makes your -1 moves safe against 0F.
Dong does 214B which has 25F recovery, but the opponent's 24F hitstun allows the opponent one frame to try to punish with 0F super at 25F.
1. Dong's window/buffer to do 623 B/B+D/B+C should be for a normal (7 frames) for 1F-6F before the end of his 214B recovery and 1F after (20-25F of recovery + 26F).
And with the opponent's anticipated 0F super, you'll have just 6 frames (20-25F of recovery) to do the input.
2. When opponent does their 0F super and goes into blackout, repeatedly mash A.
3. After the opponent's blackout and forced time stop, your 623A is put out for a counter-attack.
See this link for video of this example.
Backdash Example
Ave Maria backdash follows backdash reversal timing for the type of recovery you are in.
Backdash works if 2nd direction input is done at the same time as super (such as when super is done on the 2nd frame of landing)
Backdashing an Air Hit Landing
Gato attempts an air hit landing unblockable with Zero Kiba (236(x2)A) on the 2nd frame of air hit landing recovery.
But your backdash input is completed 1F before landing, and you backdash the super after exiting forced time stop.
Backdash reception window is limited to landing recovery and until blackout.
(1F before landing recovery, 1F-3F of landing recovery,
and 1F after landing recovery, for a total of 5F)
Backdashing a +1 Hit
Gato 6A, 236(x2)A
6A is +1, and after 19F of recovery, the super hits the last frame of hitstun/blockstun at 20F.
Backdash reception window for 2nd direction input is:
the last 1F-4F of hitstun/blockstun,
and 1F after exiting hitstun/blockstun
(for a total of 5F)
In other words, the backdash window/buffer is 1F-3F before blackout, and 1F of blackout.
Backdashing a 0F Punish of Your -1 Hit
Dong 214B has 25F recovery but 24F hitstun allows opponent one frame to try to punish with 0F super at 25F.
Window/buffer for backdash should be 5 frames -- 1-4F before the end of 214B recovery and 1F after.
And with opponent's 0F, it will be just be 4 frames (22-25F of recovery)
2AB Example
This method uses the startup invincibility of 2AB's to avoid supers that have 1 hit.
Gato 6A, 236(x2)A
6A is +1, and after 19F of recovery, the super hits the last frame of hitstun/blockstun at 20F.
2AB reception window is:
the last 1F-6F of hitstun/blockstun,
and 1F after exiting hitstun/blockstun
(for a total of 7F)
In other words, the real 2AB window/buffer is now 1F-5F before blackout, and 1F of blackout.
Okizeme attack on opponent's wake-up
In the case of okizeme (attacking during someone's wake-up) the same thing is basically done.
1. During the opponent's wake-up, slightly delay a normal move while putting it with the command for the move you want to after-cancel, by using motion storing with simultaneous button pressing.
2. When the opponent tries to use a blackout move to counter-attack,
repeatedly press the button of the move you want to use.
3. The after-cancel will be executed and counter-attack the opponent instead.
Since the simultaneous press is done raw outside of any recovery, hitstun/blockstun, etc.
there is no window/interval to consider besides your normal's recovery
and the super's blackout and forced time stop.
The after cancel is a technique that uses a whiff kara cancel,
so be aware that if you completely meaty a normal move on the opponent's wake-up,
you maybe not be able to follow-up with anything.
(because of exceeding the whiff kara cancelable frames)
Anti-Freeze OS
This method can be used as an "anti-blackout OS" or "anti-freeze OS" beyond okizeme when you do any advancing attack and press your advantage.
It's very useful against people throwing out random supers.
For example: Going near the passive opponent, Jenet inputs 236236 2BD. Becomes 2B.
If a S/P-power comes out, Jenet presses B again to have her S-power come out.
Here is a post with video of this example.
Ave Maria Explanation
Special/Super Command Input:
The game does not accept any special/super command during blackout, but the input reception time remains preserved during that time.
You have to complete the command input before blackout
of the move you want to after-cancel after blackout.
In order to satisfy this condition and perform a normal move without activating a special move,
the simultaneous button press technique is used to do a normal move.
We detailed how to do this out of neutral for okizeme in an above example.
This is also useful coming out of hitstun/blockstun recovery,
where you don't have to risk having your reversal special/super blocked by doing a normal instead.
And if you don't have to worry about anything coming out of recovery after inputting your command,
you can forgo the simultaneous button press and go for different buttons pressed before and after blackout
(as shown in another example above).
So for after-cancel or other avoidance method you use,
the input reception is preserved during the recovery you are currently in.
- the type of action being buffered (see Timing For Reversals)
- buffering special/super with normal or evasive attack
(either simultaneous button pressing or singular button pressing) -- 7F buffer window - buffering backdash -- 5F buffer window
- buffering evasive attack (especially 2AB) -- 7F buffer window
- buffering special/super with normal or evasive attack
- the recovery you are currently in
- recovery after doing your own attack
- normal recovery
- special recovery
- air hit landing recovery
- jump normal landing recovery
- recovery from blockstun or hitstun after receiving an attack
- after receiving an air hit landing recovery
- recovery after doing your own attack
The input reception is with respect to this recovery
but limited to being pressed before the super blackout, as shown with the above examples.
Note on Repeated Pressing at the End of Blackout:
It seems that the input for the second part of Ave Maria also has the window/buffer of the reversal timing for normals, a reversal reception of 7F total.
This window ends at 1F after forced time stop, the 1st frame of of special/super. And depending on how long forced time stop is, it could extend longer into the frames at the end of blackout.
For example, Gato's Zero Kiba (236(x2)A) has 5F of forced time stop.
The input window for the second part of Ave Maria is
1F before the end of blackout, 1F-5F of forced time stop,
and 1F after where the super executes (7F total window).
So in order to ensure you press during the reception window/buffer, you mash the button. But even if you mash, the reception window/buffer is small enough that your mash timing could still miss it.
Adding a Backdash to Special/Super Move Input
In addition, you can input a backdash after your move command during the after cancel.
As an example, when using Terry on the 1P side
to prepare an after cancel power dunk, you can insert a backdash:
Buffer 623N4N4 and at the end of blackout (and afterwards) press D repeatedly,
OR buffer 62N4N4 and at the end of blackout (and afterwards)
press 3+D repeatedly (N=Neutral)
If you do the input and a blackout isn't done, then backdash comes out.
If blackout is done, then power dunk comes out.
It is relatively low-risk read,
but to do it together correctly with the move, the input is difficult
(especially in the case of supers)
Also, the reason why there are two input methods
is that depending on the technical affinity/compatibility,
it is not possible to counter-attack back
unless you choose between one of the inputs.
TOP Hit Confirm
During the time-stopped state when the opponent enters TOP, the direction inputs are accepted, unlike when the opponent is in freeze/blackout when he does a super move.
By using this technique, the opponent's TOP can be greatly reduced (ideally eliminated) by connecting a single-hit check move to a special move that would normally be impossible to confirm as a hit.
A TOP Hit Confirm is a technique that aims to greatly reduce (ideally, eliminate) the opponent's TOP.
Adjust the opponent's life points with a single normal attack that can be (chain) canceled so that they can enter TOP, and when the attack hits and time stops, enter a special move command during that time.
When the time-stop ends, the special move can be canceled by inputting the button at the right moment.
Example of using psuedo chain cancel... with Marco:
1. Hit a Standing A to get the opponent into TOP
2. Enter 236 during the time-stop effect
3. After the time-stop is over, if you piano the C and then A, the cancel into 236C will appear.
(If you do 236236 instead when entering the 2 direction, you can pseudo chain cancel into Ha-ou Shoukou Ken (236(x2)P).)
It is especially effective if you use a light attack as the normal move to TOP-in, as the subsequent special move will pseudo chain cancel even if the light attack hits a mid-air opponent. (Of course, if the special move occurs too late, it won't work as a pseudo chain cancel into a combo.)
Also, if the TOP-in is done while the player is recovering his strength by JD, the directional inputs are still accepted.
Although the chances are probably small, it will be a great asset for Guard Cancel to be done because it gives leeway to do the input.
