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=== Armoring Through DPs === | === Armoring Through DPs === | ||
Using armored specials to call out OD DPs can be a decent strategy for Marisa. It can not only win interactions with DPs but also beat other abare options, and in the case of Scutum can beat patient blocking with a delayed Enfold OS. Armor interactions against DPs is character specific, below is a table documenting these interactions. | Using armored specials to call out OD DPs can be a decent strategy for Marisa. It can not only win interactions with DPs but also beat other abare options, and in the case of Scutum can beat patient blocking with a delayed Enfold OS. It can be a good option against opponents trying to take advantage of the 5MP target combo gap, or against opponents trying to stop drive rush block strings. Armor interactions against DPs is character specific, below is a table documenting these interactions. | ||
When armoring through Multi hit OD DPs with OD Gladius, Gladius must be charged for the extra hit of armor and to ideally whiff if possible. Meaty OD Gladius is assumed to be timed in a best case scenario where it is just late enough to catch jumps and longer range lows but not too meaty where the armor will run out before an OD DP becomes active (Hitting on frame 4 after their wakeup). Meaty OD Gladius interactions can vary wildly with timing differences. Take it with a grain of salt. | When armoring through Multi hit OD DPs with OD Gladius, Gladius must be charged for the extra hit of armor and to ideally whiff if possible. Meaty OD Gladius is assumed to be timed in a best case scenario where it is just late enough to catch jumps and longer range lows but not too meaty where the armor will run out before an OD DP becomes active (Hitting on frame 4 after their wakeup). Meaty OD Gladius interactions can vary wildly with timing differences. Take it with a grain of salt. | ||
Revision as of 17:40, 28 June 2023
Neutral
TO-DO
Offense
Frame Traps
Light Chains - 2LP and 2LK are Marisa's only chainable lights. Chaining from 2LK will frame trap, but chaining from 2LP will have at least a 4F gap.
Tick Throws - charged 3HP as well as 5LP after DR create tick throw situations. In the corner 5LK, 5MK, and 2MP will also tick throw after DR. 2MP can work midscreen against some opponents depending on their walk speed.
Command Grab Tick Throws - DR cancel straight into 214K > grab will frame trap only off of 6HK and a DR enhanced 2MP. While the opponent is in burnout a DR cancel out of regular 2MP will work. While the opponent is in burnout DR enhanced charged s.HP and 3HP will tick throw into command grab. 4HP as well but corner only.
Okizeme and Mixups
TO-DO
Good KD advantages you want to setup with frame kills, spacing dependent.
- 42: Safe jump
- 41: Matchup specific safe jump
- 23: 1F Meaty drive rush 5HP, enables tick throw; 2F Meaty DR 5MK, enables tick throw; DR meaty command grab.
- 13: 3F Meaty 5MK, +1 on block. Hit confirmable 5MP link. 4HP link on CH; Meaty command grab.
- 8-9: 2-3F Meaty 5MP, plus on block. 2LP link on hit.
Knockdown Advantage: all scenarios assume that opponent will Back Rise midscreen when possible, unless otherwise stated
| Knockdown | KD Adv. | Oki/Notes |
|---|---|---|
| Forward Throw | KD +23 | Against a midscreen back recovery, neutral is largely reset. OD 236KK and DR pressure are options but both are generally unrewarding on block for the meter spent.
In the corner, Marisa gets a basic throw loop after forward dashing leaving her +1. Note that throw will lose to 4F jabs. Also in the corner, DR 5HP hits 1F meaty becoming +2 on block allowing for a tick throw and a 4HP link on normal hit. DR pressure can also be feinted with DR 2LP Leaving Marisa -3 and out of throw range. Charged 5HP is a meterless pressure option as well. It's safe to wakeup DI but susceptible to a DP or super on reaction. For a midscreen punish counter throw, all the corner pressure can apply except for Charged 5HP which will whiff. |
| Back Throw | KD +33 | Against a midscreen back recovery, Marisa can get some pressure with a DR 5HP or 2MK.
When throwing the opponent into the corner Marisa can forward dash and be +11, giving her a meaty command grab. Skip the dash and 623HP hits meaty making it +4 on block. DR Charged 5HP hits fast enough to trade with 4F jabs leading to huge trade combos, but this will lose to wake-up DI. DR 3HP or charged 4HP are good alternatives be DI safe, but both require a small manual delay. Empty DR is +7. For a midscreen punish counter throw or neutral recovery, forward dash is too far away to threaten a throw so DR is needed to enforce a strike/throw. Most DR pressure options for a corner throw work on a midscreen punish counter throw. |
| Enfold (214K~LP+LK) | HKD +20 | In the corner, Drive Rush gives strike throw mix. DR 5MK sets up a tick throw on block and a big corner combo on hit. Empty DR is -6. Midscreen, DR pressure is less threatening, but throw can still be threatened despite having a 7ish frame gap and DR 5MK threatens a 2MP link on hit. 236LK/MK Keeps the opponent locked down while being largely spaced to be safe and potentially catching the opponent in a spacing trap. |
| 2HK | HKD +29 HKD +44 (Counter/Punish) |
Standard manually timed drive rush oki can be applied. Forward dash leaves Marisa at +7, giving her an auto-timed meaty 5LP or 5MP. A charged 6HK hits 3 frames meaty and M.Phalanx hits 2 frames meaty. On counter hits, a 5LK frame kill sets up a 2F meaty DR 5MK and a 6MP frame kill sets up a +3 meaty 5MK/command grab mixup. |
| L.Dimachaerus (214LP~6P) | KD +31 | Sets up a meaty charged 3HP on both recovery options. Safe against DI, but pretty reactable with a DP, super, or even a perfect parry. In the corner forward dash sets up a meaty 5MP or 2MP. Midscreen 623HP is another automatic meaty option. |
| M.Dimachaerus (214MP~6P) | KD +36 | What Marisa usually goes into from 5MP~MP when conserving drive gauge. Dash up 6HK hits 1F meaty. DR charged s.HP Frame traps for better pressure on block. Charged 236MP hits meaty but is highly telegraphed. In the corner, a 5MP frame kill sets up a perfect meaty 5MP or 2MP. A frame kill 2LP sets up a meaty 3HP. |
| Phalanx (623LP/MP/HP) | KD +42 | Sets up a safe jump in the corner (or midscreen against a neutral recovery). When ending a juggle with this it can sometimes give a +43 or more KD which will make the jumping normal whiff if not delayed. Picking the right strength of Phalanx or manually delaying juggles to make sure the opponent is low to the ground when hit by Phalanx will prevent this extra KD advantage. Doesn't work with fully charged air normals. Against characters with frame 0 grab supers, hold up until a block is confirmed. -2 when perfect parried. |
| H.Dimachaerus (214HP~6P) > 3HP | KD +41 | A safe jump setup that works midscreen against both recovery options. Works against 6F reversals and slower. loses to 5F reversal anti-airs such as light Shoryuken, but these can be baited with an empty jump. Against a neutral recovery midscreen, Marisa needs to jump in with j.LK to hit crossup. Works from OD Dimachaerus as well. -3 when perfect parried. |
vs. Burnout
- Plus Normals - All but 2HK are plus on block.
- Plus Specials - Uncharged OD Gladius (236PP), H Quadriga (236HK), and Tonitrus first hit (214K~P) become plus on block.
- Looping 623MP - Marisa can loop 623MP filling either 5LP~LP for a true block string or 4HP for a charged/uncharged mix. after 5LP target combo and uncharged 4HP there is a 6F gap before the 623MP hits, but Marisa can frame trap after charged 4HP or by using 623LP instead. 623LP pushes her out far enough that she can't frame trap with 5LP/4HP again.
- 623MP, 5LP~LP > 236HP > lvl 3 - 1800 chip damage true block string
- 5HP~HP target combo frame traps
- 236[P], 5HP, 2LP all frame traps
Drive Rush
When cancelling a normal into Drive Rush on block and following it up with another normal, there may be an interruptible gap in the blockstring. The following table lists these blockstring gaps when performed at the fastest possible timing.
| Gap Value | Meaning |
|---|---|
| 0 | True Blockstring (no gap) if input with fastest button timing; can still lose to Drive Reversal |
| 1 to 4 | Small blockstring gap; opponent can interrupt with an invincible reversal; a 4f gap can trade with 4f normal attack |
| 5+ | Large blockstring gap; opponent can interrupt without an invincible attack |
| 5LP | 5MP | 5HP | 5LK | 5MK | 5HK | 2LP | 2MP | 2HP | 2LK | 2MK | 2HK | 6MP | 3HP | 4HP | 6HK | 5[HP] | 5[HK] | 2[HP] | 2[HK] | 3[HP] | 4[HP] | 6[HK] | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 5LP~LP~DR | 0 | 0 | 3 | 0 | 2 | 6 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 1 | 12 | 0 | 5 | 17 | 18 | 12 | 14 | 22 | 11 | 18 |
| 2LP~DR | 9 | 10 | 15 | 9 | 14 | 18 | 7 | 11 | 12 | 8 | 12 | 14 | 13 | 24 | 11 | 17 | 29 | 30 | 24 | 26 | 34 | 23 | 30 |
| 5LK~DR | 6 | 7 | 12 | 6 | 11 | 15 | 4 | 8 | 9 | 5 | 9 | 11 | 10 | 21 | 8 | 14 | 26 | 27 | 21 | 23 | 31 | 20 | 27 |
| 5MP~MP~DR | 1 | 2 | 7 | 1 | 6 | 10 | 0 | 3 | 4 | 0 | 4 | 6 | 5 | 16 | 3 | 9 | 21 | 22 | 16 | 18 | 26 | 15 | 22 |
| 2MP~DR | 0 | 0 | 5 | 0 | 4 | 8 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 0 | 2 | 4 | 3 | 14 | 1 | 7 | 19 | 20 | 14 | 16 | 24 | 13 | 20 |
| 4HP~DR | 0 | 0 | 3 | 0 | 2 | 6 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 2 | 1 | 12 | 0 | 5 | 17 | 18 | 12 | 14 | 22 | 11 | 15 |
| 6HK~DR | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 3 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 9 | 0 | 2 | 14 | 15 | 9 | 11 | 19 | 8 | 13 |
| 4[HP]~DR | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 7 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 13 | 7 | 9 | 17 | 6 | 13 |
| 6[HK]~DR | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 7 | 0 | 0 | 12 | 13 | 7 | 9 | 17 | 6 | 13 |
The following table lists the general BnB combo routes when cancelling a button into Drive Rush on hit.
| Starter | Hit Adv. | Combo Route |
|---|---|---|
| 5LP | +4 | 5LP~5LP target combo which then goes into 214PP, 236MP, 236LK etc. |
| 2LP | +7 | 5MP link |
| 5LK | +4 | 2LP link, DR to 2LP, cancel to 214PP |
| 2MP | +7 | 5MP link, cancel into 236KK, or cancel straight into 214HP if close enough |
| 5MK | +8 | 4HP link, 2MP link at further ranges |
| 5HP | +7 | 5MP link |
| 4HP | +7 | 5MP link, Cancel to 236KK, but generally just go into 214HP like normal if you don't need a hit confirm |
| 3HP | +4 | 2LP link |
Armoring Through DPs
Using armored specials to call out OD DPs can be a decent strategy for Marisa. It can not only win interactions with DPs but also beat other abare options, and in the case of Scutum can beat patient blocking with a delayed Enfold OS. It can be a good option against opponents trying to take advantage of the 5MP target combo gap, or against opponents trying to stop drive rush block strings. Armor interactions against DPs is character specific, below is a table documenting these interactions.
When armoring through Multi hit OD DPs with OD Gladius, Gladius must be charged for the extra hit of armor and to ideally whiff if possible. Meaty OD Gladius is assumed to be timed in a best case scenario where it is just late enough to catch jumps and longer range lows but not too meaty where the armor will run out before an OD DP becomes active (Hitting on frame 4 after their wakeup). Meaty OD Gladius interactions can vary wildly with timing differences. Take it with a grain of salt.
| Character | Scutum | OD Scutum | Gladius | Charged OD Gladius | Meaty OD Gladius |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Luke | Loses | Full Punish (+44) | Loses | Full Punish (+26) | Loses |
| Jamie | Hits (+3) | Hits (+3) | Hits (KD) | Hits (KD) | Full Punish (+38~) |
| Juri | Loses | Full Punish (+33) | Loses | Full Punish (+33) | Loses |
| Dee Jay | Full Punish (+40) | Full Punish (+40) | Full Punish (+33) | Full Punish (+33) | Full Punish (+50~) |
| Cammy | Hits (+3) | Hits (+3) | Full Punish (+22) | Full Punish (+22) | Hits (KD) |
| Ryu | Loses | Loses | Loses | Full Punish (+28) | Loses |
| E. Honda | Loses | Full Punish (+19) | Loses | Hits (KD) | Hits (KD) |
| Blanka | Full Punish (+41) | Full Punish (+41) | Full Punish (+23) | Full Punish (+23) | Full Punish (+37~) |
| Guile | Loses | Loses | Loses | Full Punish (+17) | Loses |
| Ken | Hits if spaced (KD) | Hits if spaced (KD) | Loses | Hits (KD) | Loses |
| Chun-Li | Hits (KD) | Hits (KD) | Full Punish (+15) | Full Punish (+15) | Full Punish (+30~) |
Defense
Reversals
Anti-Airs
Marisa has many situational anti-airs. None are perfect, each having their own weaknesses. Overall, Marisa has a harder time controlling her airspace due to having many slow and situational options that must not only be quickly decided upon, but quickly executed as well.
- 2HP - Go to anti-air normal
- A little slow at 10F (the first active frame doesn't hit high enough to anti-air). Puts the opponent into a juggle state causing a knockdown as opposed to the more common air reset state on other anti-air normals. On normal and counter hits, Marisa does not normally get combos except at very precise angles. On punish counter however, Marisa can parry drive rush for a full combo.
- 214LP Dimachaerus - Air invulnerable special move
- Air invulnerability starts up on frame 5 and the move itself is relatively slow at 12 frames so quick reactions are needed to make use of it. This special moves Marisa forward and doesn't cover the space directly overhead making it unusable against jumps that would crossup or land directly over head.
- 214PP OD Dimachaerus - Air invulnerable metered anti-air
- Has all the weaknesses of LP Dimachaerus including an even slower startup of 16, but with potentially huge reward on hit with meter and/or corner positioning.
- 214K Scutum - Situational armored anti-air
- Fast armor at frame 3. Completely whiffs on crossups and shallow jump-ins such as an early j.HP from Dee Jay or Ken. Being an armored option it is somewhat weak to empty jumps. Marisa can beat an empty jump by command grabbing the opponent during their landing recovery, but this removes her armor during startup and opens her up to a delayed deep jump-in. The OD version has frame 1 armor, theoretically allowing Marisa to rise from a crouching position into immediate standing armor negating the possibility of a whiff, but this requires just frame execution and timing and is just as susceptible if not more so to empty jumps.
- 236LP Gladius - Another situational armored anti-air
- Decently fast armor at frame 5. Generally Gladius should be charged until a hit is absorbed or the opponent is about to land. The light version is usually the best as it will hit the fastest after absorbing a hit, but the heavy version still has some utility as a preemptive option since it can be charged for longer. It has similar weaknesses to Scutum both being armored options, but Gladius will not whiff against shallow jump-ins nor will it whiff against jump-ins directly above Marisa as long as they don't land crossup. However it is much more likely to allow the opponent to land and block Gladius with a deep jump-in potentially leading to a punish. OD Gladius is an improved option with frame 1 armor which lasts all the way until recovery making it immune to last minute counterhits from deep jump-ins.
- j.MP~MP - air-to-air target combo
- A great way to preemptively stop crossups if caught early enough. Does decent damage and allows for drive rush oki.
- Jump back j.LP - Fast 4F air-to-air
- 3 frames faster than j.MP which could make all the difference. It's less rewarding on hit, but the extra speed makes up for it.
- lvl 2 Super - Decently fast 9F fully invincible super
- Moves Marisa forward immediately after the super flash which gives it a dead zone above Marisa. A notable option being frame 1 invincible, but like Dimachaerus it has similar dead zones. Because of the motion input, it's not a significantly better reactive anti-air than Dimachaerus unless you're already buffering the input or playing with Modern controls.
- Perfect Parry
- Worth mentioning as it can be the only answer to crossups and meaty jump-ins.
Anti-Projectile
Fighting vs. Marisa
Beat Armor with Lows - TODO
Use Neutral Jumps - Counter Marisa's forward advancing pokes with neutral jumps.
Parry Telegraphed Meaties - TODO
Exploit Marisa's Weak Lows - Marisa has no access to DR combos or OD specials off any of her lows. Her c.LK combos whiff at max range as well. This makes shimmies and backwards movement during her plus frames relatively low risk.
8F Super After MP Target Combo - TODO
